Define hands_clasped, palms_together, hand_on_hand, etc.; revise and resolve conflicting wiki pages regarding interlocked_fingers

Edit: Added Clean Diagram in post 3 of this topic.

Check out this Simple and Lovely Diagram[tm]

own_hands_together is when a single character touches their hands together.
holding_hands is when two or more characters' hands are touching.

interlocked_fingers is fingers interlocking/interlacing.
hands_together is [any hands touching each other] without interlocked fingers.

A single instance of own_hands_together or holding_hands may feature either interlocked_fingers or hands_together but not both. They do not implicate each other, but using one from a pair should generally result in using one from the other pair.

So far, so good. You still with me?

Resolve conflicting descriptions of interlocked_fingers in the wiki pages

See the following excerpts, current at time of writing:

interlocked fingers

Remember to also add:

• holding hands: if the character is interlocking fingers with another character.
• hands clasped: if the character does this with their own hands AND the palms touching one another.

hands clasped

See interlocked fingers when two people interlace their fingers with each other, and use hands together when one's hands are together without fingers interlaced.

This tag implicates own_hands_together (learn more).

hands together

For when characters have their own hands together or are holding the hand(s) of other characters, without the fingers being interlocked. See hands clasped and interlocked fingers respectively for when the fingers are interlocked.

The first one lets interlocked_fingers apply to both solo and multiple characters. The other two are written like it only applies to multiple characters and that solo characters must use hands_clasped instead.
I believe the first should be true and that the other two should be changed to reflect this. Continue below.

Hands clasped

The definition of the verb "clasp" means "grasp (something) tightly with one's hand" or "press one's hands together with the fingers interlaced".

post #3799495: Fingers are interlocked and palms are together. Great example.
post #3809264: Fingers are interlocked but the palms are nowhere close to each other. Heck, the base of the fingers (where the fingers meet the palms) do not touch, so this cannot be that tight of a hold. This should not be tagged hands_clasped.

Proposal: create implication hands_clasped -> interlocked_fingers

Proposal: remove implication hands_clasped -> own_hands_together
There'll be a shit ton of holding_hands interlocked_fingers missing hands_clasped tag. On the other hand, it seems pretty weird for hands_clasped to apply only to own_hands_together; it would seem especially weird to treat hands_clasped and interlocked_fingers the same but distinguish them by solo and not-solo (if they were the "same" then there shouldn't need to be two tags), therefore I give hands_clasped a meaning not tied to number of characters; and we should do something about the conflicting wiki pages regarding interlocked_fingers.

I propose revising the wiki to read the following:

For when characters have their own hands together or are holding the hand(s) of other characters, with the fingers being interlocked and the palms touching or close to. At least one hand must have their fingers touch the back of the other hand, for example the background of post #3805654.

If the fingers are not interlocked, see hands together and palms together.

After removal of implication and revision of wiki:
post #3703764 solo and post #3723948 multi have loosely interlaced fingers and would both be tagged interlocked_fingers without hands_clasped.
post #3744167 solo and post #3757464 multi would both be tagged hands_clasped, along with interlocked_fingers.

Hands together

I propose revising the wiki to read the following:

For when characters have their own hands together or are holding the hand(s) of other characters, without the fingers being interlocked. Add palms together if hands and fingers are flat together.

If the fingers are interlocked, instead use:

• Interlocked fingers: if the character interlocks fingers.
• Hands clapsed: if the character interlocks fingers with palms touching or close to.

See Also

• Holding hands
• Own hands together

Palms together

palms_together currently does not have a wiki page.
post #3742255: Palms and fingers are flat together; fingers aren't interlocked. Great example.

Proposal: create implication palms_together -> hands_together

For tagging purposes, it can be a subset of non-interlocked hands_together resembling the folded hands emoji 🙏.
If there is an example I am not aware of where the fingers are bent back slightly, it still applies.

Multiple characters may be involved, but do not confuse with high_five. Examples: post #3809271, post #2711722, post #2843773. Check: Should holding_hands apply to these? It's written in the wiki as "When two or more characters' hands are touching." Unlike a high five which is an act of smacking hands and is not holding hands, palms together is not a smack or clap.

Check: Should images with spread_fingers apply? Examples: post #3733092 solo, post #914279 multi.

TL;DR

It's not that complicated, really:

• Let solo own_hands_together and holding_hands be exclusively hands_together or interlocked_fingers. Let hands_clasped be a subset of (implicate?) interlocked_fingers where palms are touching or close to and the fingers are interlocked and touching the back of hands. Let palms_together be a subset of hands_together. See that Simple and Lovely Diagram[tm] at the top of this post.
• Revise and resolve the wiki pages.
• Give palms_together a wiki with a clarified meaning and create implication with hands_together.

2020-03-15 edit: Section "Hand on hand" and afterward.

Other

Gendou pose

Once we have established that hands_clasped must have palms touching:
remove implication gendou_pose -> hands_clasped
add implication gendou_pose -> own_hands_together
Reason: The Gendou pose does not involve clasped hands as palms are not touching. Most have interlocked fingers but post #2645685 (unsure if even counts) and post #2127809 (featuring Gendou himself) are outliers in that the fingers don't interlock, so we won't implicate with interlocked_fingers.

Hand on hand

Hand_on_hand is rarely used and isn't mentioned anywhere, but could this fill a role? Possibly mainly having hand on top on another hand, palms not facing each other (to avoid tagging everything already tagged holding_hand) and may apply to both solo and multi. Shares similarity to holding_hand but with palm orientation and the acting hand probably will not come from the bottom upwards.
post #2795177, post #3671310 and post #3650505: Their hands are at rest with one palm on the backside of the other hand. Basic examples.
post #3720716 and post #3563918: Their hands are technically clasped but not by the meaning we gave it. Check: In addition to the usual own_hands_together hands_together, should these also be tagged hand_on_hand?

Strangely, at time of writing nearly no images with this tag were tagged with anything else.

Proposed creation of wiki ("See also" hidden for this topic):

Use when palm-side of the hand is horizontally resting atop another hand or is actively touching the back of another hand.

Examples

• post #2795177 (self) and post #3816307 (multi): Top hand is horizontally resting atop another hand, which is also at rest.
• post #3720716 and post #3563918: These may be considered hand clasping but hands clasped requires palms to be touching, so use this tag instead.
• post #3814851 and post #3816024: These subjects are holding onto the back of another's hand that is touching their face. The second image is nearly holding_hands but isn't.
• Rare example: post #3776838 also features interlocked_fingers from behind.
• Rare example: Left side of post #1262301 applies despite suspended hands. Tag with discretion.

Diagram of related tags

Added and effective on 2020-03-DD to structurize these tags (topic #16651). Start from the top and add tags downward.
Exception: If both hands are horizontally at rest and not own hands together, then skip holding_hand(s) due to ambiguity and tag hands_together hand_on_hand. However, if the top hand has a finger/thumb underneath the other hand, then also tag holding hand.

Answers to above "check" questions

Yes. (1) Follows hierarchy as described in Clean Diagram below. (2) No strong reason to forbid using palms_together with spread_fingers. (3) Defining hand_on_hand provides a suitable for use with those non-interlocked otherwise clasped hands.

Holding hand

post #3309617 is an example of would-be clasped_hands while being holding_hand instead of holding_hands since only one character has his fingers gripping the other hand.

TL;DR main issue

I failed to describe the main issue under section "TL;DR" above, so here it is:

• The wikis of (hands_clasped and hands_together) and interlocked_fingers itself treat interlocked_fingers differently.
• If hands_clasped and interlocked_fingers are essentially the same but distinguished by one or multiple characters, respectively, then having these separate tags is nearly redundant.
• Therefore, either delete hands_clasped (undesired), or remove own_hands_together implication and enforce "palms touching" as originally described in the wiki of interlocked_fingers (proposed) to distinguish between posts featuring interlocked fingers with or without palms touching/tighter grip.

Clean Diagram

I propose linking this diagram in the wikis, at least temporarily until the wikis seem good enough to go without, to get every reader on the same page.

Full bulk request (actual request not made yet)

create implication hands_clasped -> interlocked_fingers
remove implication hands_clasped -> own_hands_together

create implication palms_together -> hands_together

create implication gendou_pose -> own_hands_together
remove implication gendou_pose -> hands_clasped

Reason: see topic #16651