You've done well, Okuu! Take your rest, you deserved it. This is her(and Tenshi's) ERA after all! Congratulations Heavenly Sky! And also props for the Lost Servants! It was an awesome match!
Both sides did a good job of fighting. Congrats to HS for winning!
Still, it's hard to tell from that pic. Tenshi's shoulders seems to be on at mat as well, so there may be a chance that it could be a draw. Moments like that have happened in wrestling, after all. Well, it's probably best to wait for the translations.
Its official this match is bullshit... it should have ended in a draw or as Lost Servants' win since they had the upperhand, and all of Lost Servants' development has now gone to waste....
But atleast these commenters are more fair then the other guys that have been commenting by actually giving praise to Lost Servants
Tenshi's shoulders also being down were the first thing that came to my mind after the suplex. It's entirely possible we'll get a draw with both teams advancing to the Moriya match, since that seems the best way to convince the audience it's remotely possible for the Moriyas to lose.
FRien said: It's official that no matter what the outcome is, someone is crying.
Hey guess what? I'm not crying. Why? Because I'm glad this stupid match is over.
Kilgamayan said: It's not going to waste - we're getting LS vs. Scarlet 75% as a final day undercard match. You think Suika has forgotten how Reimu jilted her?
Red 75%, and we don't know that, and what do you mean by jilted?
Yes! Yes! Yessss! Tenshi, you're amazing! Bring that team to victory! Oh, these matches get better and better as it narrows down, fans on each side! I've been rooting for HS since the start tho, I just can't say no to Tenshi. I wonder who HS is going to stomp next! Also, I worry what Remilia is going to say to Sakuya...
For those who think Heavenly Sky is a non strategic team in the previous pages. Let's take a look here.
Both team have seen how each other fights, HS even got a friend team to teach them what they know about LS, mainly about Sakuya having a timestop-wall and being good at grappling and how to fight an oni. That's a plus there. So it's only logical for them to find a way to counter each other. Do note here that HS still haven't found a way around Sakuya's Time Wall.
Both team also had some kind of training, two that we know, which is Utsuho's training to break from grabs by transforming, and Sakuya's training for concentration, grabbing techniques, and endurance, with various sparring partner. We haven't seen Tenshi's but it's probably an endurance training too(if headbutt vs oni punch in the beginning is any indication) and Suika might did no training at all other than being Sakuya's sparring partner.
Now let's see how they utilize it in the match so far.
First, we had A POSING MATCH!! There we see once again the Heavenly Sky showing how they trusted each other by doing another ridiculously awesome pose, with Minoriko to boot, waving to the audience! And we got Lost Servant performing an ELEGANT pose! Shocking HS and showed that even while drunk Sakuya is still the Perfect Elegant Maid! Okay this part might be moot, but Sakuya's balancing of the dish shows just how good her concentration is. Are we good?
The match start with Tenshi vs Sakuya. There we see that Sakuya had perfected her Time Wall, stopping all of Tenshi's chops. Tenshi kept going until Sakuya started to get distracted and took a hit. Then we're shown how good Sakuya is at grappling techniques. Tenshi counters but that's it. From this she found 2 ways to get through Sakuya's Time Wall, by breaking her concentration and through grappling(which isn't really practical given how good Sakuya is at grappling).
Next we have Tenshi vs Suika. Not much to say here. Other than showing Tenshi's durability and a little 'service', Suika pretty much dominated the match until Okuu made a cut in with a God Chop and even then still made Tenshi took a hit with Sakuya's help. From this we can see that Suika is testing what HS can do and took a God Chop to see how powerful it is(much to her chagrin). And Tenshi also found another method to counter Sakuya's Time Wall, by blocking her vision.
Then we got Okuu vs Suika. Okuu pretty much tried to fight in her best field, which is aerial battle, to get around Suika's melee combat prowess. It worked until Suika proved to be too much even in the air. Then Okuu went for Falling Star of Darkness and successfully baited Suika to take a God Chop in giant form. From this we can clearly see that Suika is confident, too confident even, that she got caught off guard and took massive damage. And Okuu has been fighting effectively here, doing what she does best and successfully executed the tactic that was obviously planned from before the match.
Then we go back to Tenshi vs Sakuya. Tenshi tried implementing the methods that she found, but got grappled. We're shown that all that hits wore Tenshi down a lot and were at Sakuya's mercy until Okuu's epic cut in. The table turned a while and Sakuya took a heavy hit.
After that is a full on brawl, Tenshi took more hits, Okuu escaped by transforming, hitting Sakuya, and helped Tenshi to hit Sakuya once more. Then Okuu carried Suika away and Tenshi finished a worn out Sakuya and the match ends.
In short, Tenshi's part in this match is to figure out how to counter Sakuya's Time Wall since Okuu can't do it, while Okuu is to use Hit & Run tactic and the 'baiting' for Suika. As for Sakuya, she pretty much utilize all her skills, and Suika just fights normally. So it's pretty clear which team did more effort to beat the others.
Let's list them, Heavenly Sky: - Found 3 way to counter Sakuya's Time Wall and utilizes it - Okuu choosing aerial battle to get around Suika(not so effective) - Preparing and successfully executing the plan to heavily damage Suika - Transforming when their guard is off and several other supports from Okuu
Lost Servants - Chipping at Tenshi's defense That's it. I don't count Suika testing the God Chop since it's obvious Sakuya can't take that. All they do in the match is using their skills like fighting any team. That is good and all but it takes more than that to call them being strategic.
Heavenly Sky on the other hand, fights in a way specifically against Lost Servants, even coming up with a plan thanks to Yuugi. Tenshi has to take a beating and enduring to figure out the way to counter Sakuya, and she did well. Not to mention that they often come up with on the fly tactics like some had mentioned before. To me, they are the more strategic team in this match. They are idiots, Okuu even admits it, but they are the genius-in-combat type of idiots.
I feel sorry for Sakuya and Suika, but Tenshi and Okuu deserved this victory. They are a really good team. Everyone is underestimating them too much. Also sorry for the wall of text.
CybeastGregarX said: Its official this match is bullshit... it should have ended in a draw or as Lost Servants' win since they had the upperhand, and all of Lost Servants' development has now gone to waste....
Hardly wasted. Sakuya likely showed Remelia that she could fight.
That was the point for her.
It would have been ridiculous for them to advance to possibly face Reimu/Remilia.
Anyway people have to realize that HS is the "Hero team".
- Fighting fair. - Growing in capabilities each match. - Bit of comic relief as well.
If Shirou sticks with the overall theme of the source material they should win the whole thing in the end.
Great! Tenshi & Okku win! Well, after this, the only thing that I worry now it´s about hers next battle against Sanae's Team... :S But, I'm satisfied with this results :D
I think the biggest let down of this match so far was that there was no drunken maid style. Cue, Sakuya taking up drinking after this match, then beating up someone.
This win didn't come without a loss for the HS team. As you can see, Okuu is more or less incapacitated herself. I only hope that we don't see another team switch again.
The match was, by far, the most intense and rewarding as I could recount in the tournament so far. It also helped that the HS won fighting with everything they've got. As for the results... Well, haters gonna hate. It's not their call, though, so too bad.
To be honest there's not a whole lot of strategy LS can do against HS. I mean look at their special abilities. Tenshi is just a 999 health tank with auto regen, and Okuu can hit real hard, fly and transform.
Strategy vs Tenshi is pretty much grapple, which they did a lot. Unless there's some anti celestial armchairs underneath the stage or something.
Strategy vs Okuu is limited to don't get hit, which for some reason they've never tried, ever. Seriously, has no one thought of stepping into a chop? Flight barely worked for her, and the transformation was used all of once.
I was wrong about the final match being Sakuya vs Remilia. Now I have a reason to keep reading this series. I just hope that plot armor gets shattered in the end.
I bit my lip extremely hard when Mokou's team lost, this time I bit my lip off. I'm not a sakuya fan but Oni fan, to me this was a bit of a let down, but I'll clap for Heavenly Sky.
I would have never thought that they would win, just like a few others here I thought Sakuya vs Remilia was already set in stone. Happy to see Heavenly Sky win this one.
khinsu said: Strategy vs Tenshi is pretty much grapple, which they did a lot.
To be fair, the grappling was super-effective and would have worked spectacularly if it wasn't for Okuu getting Tenshi out of it either time.
I actually have a pet theory about Okuu being able to deal out God Chops pretty freely but I've not seen anything to validate it yet. It involves Yatagarasu being an unintentional "third participant" in the ring, not even Okuu herself realizing it.
As it is shown in post #1218667, Sakuya and Suika gave the impression of not even considering their next opponents as a challenge, and their actions, speech and thoughts shown during the match only strengthened that impression.
Whereas, Tenshi and Okuu were shown to be focused on their upcoming match with Sakuya and Suika, and gave the impression that they took this match seriously, which was only strengthened throughout the match.
To quote Sakuya in the previous strip (post #1314799): - "There's nothing left for me if I lose..." - "I can't lose!" - "I don't want to lose!!" Those sound like the thoughts of every arrogant rival when they lose to the unlikely hero.
In my opinion, the conclusion to this match was mostly foregone since the beginning, because people like nothing better in a story than to see someone knocked off of their perch by the underdogs, and a good storyteller will pander to that.
I hate underdogs because it's a foregone conclusion that they'll somehow win. If you win, it should be because you were better than the other guy. Not because your highly telegraphed one trick pony move is allowed to connect at every given oppurtunity!
Well, it's kind of difficult for storytelling to not take precedence in a one-shot Touhou wrestling series. Pro wrestling can get away with heel victories long-term because it never ends, but this series will presumably end not too long after the final match, which means climaxes must be hit and conclusions must be reached. With that in mind, the author is (presumably) going to go with what he or she thinks is the most fulfilling story for his or her audience. If that story happens to be one about two lovable oafs rising through the ranks and grabbing the brass ring that not many, inside or outside the story, thought they were capable of getting, then so be it. Such a decision would be hardly surprising - I would bet fewer people would find a Reimu/Remilia victory more fulfilling than most other teams, for example, because they're expected to be tops and haven't really even tried very hard yet. No one really learns anything if they win, if that makes sense.
AdventZero said: This win didn't come without a loss for the HS team. As you can see, Okuu is more or less incapacitated herself. I only hope that we don't see another team switch again.
The match was, by far, the most intense and rewarding as I could recount in the tournament so far. It also helped that the HS won fighting with everything they've got. As for the results... Well, haters gonna hate. It's not their call, though, so too bad.
I don't think Okuu's that badly hurt as most off the limb breaking is in her head. (The day she finally realizes that's not the case is the day HS becomes truly overpowering) That and she's a youkai, once she's outside the barrier, she'll recover well enough on her own. The only characters shown to be in serious traction are humans (Sanae and perhaps Marisa)
Steak said: I hate underdogs because it's a foregone conclusion that they'll somehow win. If you win, it should be because you were better than the other guy. Not because your highly telegraphed one trick pony move is allowed to connect at every given opportunity!
Not always, look at Marisa's team; they were the underdogs and their assult was like a gnat versus an Elephant. Certainly comes off better than the weak part of a team getting wins against teams stronger than them. (Mind you said weak part has gotten a win that was legitimate.)
Neo_X said: No kidding, I thought I heard the end of it from Suwako and Sanae's matches.
Amen to that! and he meant by Reimu choosing Remilia over Suika.
I'm not sure if that was the case for Suika as she was one of those that found out the tournament late and incidentally and she was a ways from the shrine. If the Underground didn't crash the party, I'm not sure if Yukari would have allowed Suika to say (She did most likely because she'd be a counter to Yuugi)
Somehow I don't think Sanae and Suwako will underestimate this team. They've been though Yuuka, Flan, and Byakuren. They just don't really have time to prepare much...though given how Okuu and Tenshi look right now...they are going to need a lot of Kappa treatment if they even want to fight the recovering Moriya.
And Sakuya will learn something from this. That seems to be the pattern of these kind of matches. She had practically forgotten her promise to face Remi in the Finals and had changed to wanting to advance for Suika and Koa's sakes instead.
Remi of course only wanted to win (nothing else will do for her pride) and Reimu is in it only for the prize money. I wonder what Sakuya's lose will do to Remi's point of view. (Reimu still wants the money...not starving afterwards is important to her).
Steak said: I hate underdogs because it's a foregone conclusion that they'll somehow win. If you win, it should be because you were better than the other guy. Not because your highly telegraphed one trick pony move is allowed to connect at every given oppurtunity!
CybeastGregarX said: Its official this match is bullshit... it should have ended in a draw or as Lost Servants' win since they had the upperhand, and all of Lost Servants' development has now gone to waste....
But atleast these commenters are more fair then the other guys that have been commenting by actually giving praise to Lost Servants
It was going to be considered a bullshit victory whoever won, so I don't see any point in complaining about it.
Remi of course only wanted to win (nothing else will do for her pride) and Reimu is in it only for the prize money. I wonder what Sakuya's lose will do to Remi's point of view. (Reimu still wants the money...not starving afterwards is important to her).
Ideally, Sakuya thinks this is good enough, Remi shuns her instead of praises her, LS gets mad over being slighted by Scarlet 75% the entire series and costs Scarlet 75% their match against the immortals, and we have a legit undercard feud for the final day.
Kilgamayan said: Ideally, Sakuya thinks this is good enough, Remi shuns her instead of praises her, LS gets mad over being slighted by Scarlet 75% the entire series and costs Scarlet 75% their match against the immortals, and we have a legit undercard feud for the final day.
Thankfully there is just about a zero percentage chance of that happening.
Kilgamayan said: Ideally, Sakuya thinks this is good enough, Remi shuns her instead of praises her, LS gets mad over being slighted by Scarlet 75% the entire series and costs Scarlet 75% their match against the immortals, and we have a legit undercard feud for the final day.
Dude its Red 75%, and there truly is no promise that will actually happen for all we know Red 75% might take the championship after beating the Immortals if they do and Team Moriya or Heavenly Sky.
Although I will admit it will be interesting to see.
Pyrolight said: Thankfully there is just about a zero percentage chance of that happening.
Why not have it? It knocks the obvious favorite out of the tournament without having them be truly beaten (remember what Reimu said about this tournament and her image and the strong and the weak and all that), and it would make the resulting fight a lot more interesting than if it was a basic respect match for no particular gain. Gives 'em both bloodlust motivation, and it leaves who "should" win wide open storywise.
If I were a rasslin' writer, I'd go that route in a heartbeat.
CybeastGregarX said: But atleast these commenters are more fair then the other guys that have been commenting by actually giving praise to Lost Servants
Since when did comments become more important then the pictures? Let alone other peoples opinions that they are entitled to?
Maybe. I think Saukya and Suika learned a lot in this, and just because they lost doesn't mean their story ends. Look at Yuuka and Cirno. Their story continued after the fight. We even got that outing match with Yuuka and Ran locked together for some days while Chen and Cirno dueled...while Dai made food and drinks for them all.
Just because they lost here does not mean their story is entirely over.
Honestly, I'm happy Lost Servents lost because...well, they aren't a fun team to watch. What do they do? Sakuya's got that time shield thing, which is effective, but not really interesting to watch. People hit her and they get hurt instead. Suika hits things, then gets big and hits things. Woo. Despite all the plot stuff revolving around them...okay, revolving around Sakuya, and even that wasn't that great, it doesn't change how dull they are.
CybeastGregarX said: Which is exactly why as to how the Lost Servants' development has now been wasted because Sakuya couldn't fulfill that for them.
Not at all, the most important development as someone mentioned is Pride Before the Fall. Even before the match, since the beginning, Sakuya's main vice was portrayed to be her pride. She was too proud to ask Meiling, thinking it's the role of others she saw as underneath her to beg her. Initially she didn't even treat Koakuma as a companion, referring to her as "that".
It has been a journey to open her up and accept that this tournament should be about people having fun and giving it their all. Koakuma proved her worth, Suika and her antics loosened her up, and I suspect upcoming strips will have her come to realization and respect everyone's efforts rather than treating everything as stepping stones in her path of destiny to the mistress.
If I were a rasslin' writer, I'd go that route in a heartbeat.
It's even too chiche for this comic. Not to mention it would be a rofl stomping of a match.
Suika could hold her own but Sakuya even with her hax would be utterly destroyed.
Zaku_Zelo said: Honestly, I'm happy Lost Servents lost because...well, they aren't a fun team to watch. What do they do? Sakuya's got that time shield thing, which is effective, but not really interesting to watch. People hit her and they get hurt instead. Suika hits things, then gets big and hits things. Woo. Despite all the plot stuff revolving around them...okay, revolving around Sakuya, and even that wasn't that great, it doesn't change how dull they are.
I agree, in pretty much in every respect a LS win would not have advanced the story at all.
Too many better teams have lost to less interesting ones. It's nice to see to one finally win.
Zaku_Zelo said: Honestly, I'm happy Lost Servents lost because...well, they aren't a fun team to watch. What do they do? Sakuya's got that time shield thing, which is effective, but not really interesting to watch. People hit her and they get hurt instead. Suika hits things, then gets big and hits things. Woo. Despite all the plot stuff revolving around them...okay, revolving around Sakuya, and even that wasn't that great, it doesn't change how dull they are.
You do realize that your points for LS being boring to watch apply pretty much exactly to HS as well right. Sakuya gets hit and damage isn't done to her + negligible (in this match) damage reflect. Tenshi gets hit and damage isn't done to her + regen if it does. Suika grows big and hits things hard. Okuu shines red and hits things hard. Not much of a difference there.
If anything it's a matter of you not enjoying the characters as much.
Aquafina said: wasn't expecting it to be over so soon
I find this to be proof that at the end of the day, this was a good match. If people look at it and wonder how it ended so quickly then it was good.
I'm really happy that Heavenly Sky won and that my faith throughout this was justified. I can deal with them losing their next match if that's what happens. I honestly don't care if they win this tournament either, I just want to see them reach the finals, if they got there and lost in a blaze of glory then I'd still be happy.
Another thing that I look forward to seeing develop is Tenshi's friendship with Okuu. Tenshi is like Sakuya in terms of how she views her partner but also different. Sakuya at first just saw her partner as a tool and eventually realized that that was the wrong way to look at things. Tenshi doesn't see Okuu as a tool but she's always trying to convince both herself and others that she does and that she doesn't need any help.
I just hope that they aren't expected to go into their next match immediately like was originally intended, they're seriously worn out right now.
There is still the Immortals vs 75% Red next. Who knows how long that will take since the Immortals won't even die if Reimu kills them.
In fact that might be how Red 75% could lose. Disqualification by killing one (or both) of the Immortals. They'll be fine, but they aren't quite like Cirno.
ithekro said: Maybe. I think Sakuya and Suika learned a lot in this, and just because they lost doesn't mean their story ends. Look at Yuuka and Cirno. Their story continued after the fight. We even got that outing match with Yuuka and Ran locked together for some days while Chen and Cirno dueled...while Dai made food and drinks for them all.
Just because they lost here does not mean their story is entirely over.
Maybe but do you know how shameful Sakuya will be? Being unable to fulfill a promise and not to advance to the next round for Koa and Suika's sake after realizing that Suika and Koakuma aren't tools and tried to fix things between them will not go well for Sakuya at all which was the main reason I was for Lost Servants winning, if I am right the next page will have Sakuya just laying on the mat not moving a muscle feeling frustrated and upset while crying for unable to advance for them.
CybeastGregarX said: Maybe but do you know how shameful Sakuya will be? Being unable to fulfill a promise and not to advance to the next round for Koa and Suika's sake after realizing that Suika and Koakuma aren't tools and tried to fix things between them will not go well for Sakuya at all which was the main reason I was for Lost Servants winning, if I am right the next page will have Sakuya just laying on the mat not moving a muscle feeling frustrated and upset while crying for unable to advance for them.
Sakuya will have no issues patching things up. Suika sure as hell won't hold a grudge and understands where Sakuya is coming from and Koa never had any sort of anger towards Sakuya.
CybeastGregarX said: Maybe but do you know how shameful Sakuya will be? Being unable to fulfill a promise and not to advance to the next round for Koa and Suika's sake after realizing that Suika and Koakuma aren't tools and tried to fix things between them will not go well for Sakuya at all which was the main reason I was for Lost Servants winning, if I am right the next page will have Sakuya just laying on the mat not moving a muscle feeling frustrated and upset while crying for unable to advance for them.
Oh please, how many other teams have gone through this too? What about when Keine and Mokou lost? What about when Kirisame Familiar lost? What about when Higgen Judgement lost? What about Red 200%? Why is it a bad match only once Sakuya loses?
SpecterVonBaren said: I just hope that they aren't expected to go into their next match immediately like was originally intended, they're seriously worn out right now.
This. They need some time to bask in the glory of the victory.
SpecterVonBaren said: Oh please, how many other teams have gone through this too? What about when Keine and Mokou lost? What about when Kirisame Familiar lost? What about when Higgen Judgement lost? What about Red 200%? Why is it a bad match only once Sakuya loses?
Of course YOU wouldn't understand nor do I expect you to, and I HIGHLY doubt you even payed attention to those matches. Mokou, Scarlet 200% (get the name right) and Marisa accepted their losses, and Eiki Shiki didn't think of Komachi as a tool like Sakuya did with Suika and Koakuma originally, after realizing this she wanted to make it up to them by advancing to the next round for them, even so much as forgetting about the promise to meet with Remilia in the finals. With Eiki Shiki she wasn't ashamed about her loss but about the fact that she was exposed as an otaku of the Kinnikuman series, and after that her pride as an enma was shattered she deemed herself worthless and unfitting to be an enma.
SpecterVonBaren said: I just hope that they aren't expected to go into their next match immediately like was originally intended, they're seriously worn out right now.
According to post #1182178, the next match is the Immortal team and Red 75%, the first semifinal match. After that is the second semifinal match with Heavenly Sky and Team Moriya.
Despite Team Moriya's exhibition match, I think they still took less damage than Heavenly Sky, plus they will have had more time overall to rest by the start of the second semifinal. But story-wise (storytelling sometimes defies logic), I still think they have a decent shot at making it to the finals. Although if they don't, I will still have been happy that they've made it as far as they did.
BrokenEagle98 said: According to post #1182178, the next match is the Immortal team and Red 75%, the first semifinal match. After that is the second semifinal match with Heavenly Sky and Team Moriya.
Despite Team Moriya's exhibition match, I think they still took less damage than Heavenly Sky, plus they will have had more time overall to rest by the start of the second semifinal. But story-wise (storytelling sometimes defies logic), I still think they have a decent shot at making it to the finals. Although if they don't, I will still have been happy that they've made it as far as they did.
Ahhh, I missed that detail. I remember how when it was first announced how these matches would go, that the winner of this match was going to have to fight two matches in a row. So that's good, and another reason why I'm okay if Heavenly Sky loses to Team Moriya, Sanae's a good sport.
CybeastGregarX said:
Of course YOU wouldn't understand nor do I expect you to, and I HIGHLY doubt you even payed attention to those matches. Mokou, Scarlet 200% (get the name right) and Marisa accepted their losses, and Eiki Shiki didn't think of Komachi as a tool like Sakuya did with Suika and Koakuma originally, after realizing this she wanted to make it up to them by advancing to the next round for them, even so much as forgetting about the promise to meet with Remilia in the finals. With Eiki Shiki she wasn't ashamed about her loss but about the fact that she was exposed as an otaku of the Kinnikuman series, and after that her pride as an enma was shattered she deemed herself worthless and unfitting to be an enma.
Understand now?
No. Because in order for what you said to be a justification, it would require Sakuya not being able to move past this defeat or for things to work out in the end. You're automatically assuming that Sakuya's story will end in shame when we've seen a pattern of people having no hard feelings after losing and in some cases they even gain something from it (Like Cirno and Yuka).
Looking over the start of this event, Sanae's proposal was to give her own team a handicap. Her team would not be allowed to heal aside from emergency purposes until the fourth match, though they did have time to rest. Looks like Okuu and Tenshi are also held under that ruling, so they might not get all that fixed up during the next match, though they probably need some emergency care considering how beat up they are...even Okuu is down.
SpecterVonBaren said: No. Because in order for what you said to be a justification, it would require Sakuya not being able to move past this defeat or for things to work out in the end. You're automatically assuming that Sakuya's story will end in shame when we've seen a pattern of people having no hard feelings after losing and in some cases they even gain something from it (Like Cirno and Yuka).
Oh my god.. did I SAY anything about me automatically assuming Sakuya won't get over this and her story ending in shame? No I didn't, I said she would feel ashamed for letting those 2 down for a while, I know she will get over it and work things out in time and I merely made a guess as to what might happen.
CybeastGregarX said: Oh my god.. did I SAY anything about me automatically assuming Sakuya won't get over this and her story ending in shame? No I didn't, I said she would feel ashamed for letting those 2 down for a while, I know she will get over it and work things out in time and I merely made a guess as to what might happen.
Okay then. So why did you say this fight was bullshit? You said their development would go to waste and now you're saying it won't?
After all the exchanges in this match and the work both teams did, either team deserved to win. That is a good thing. It means they were balanced and it was a fair match in both skill and entertainment. Just what Yukari wants.
CybeastGregarX said: Oh my god.. did I SAY anything about me automatically assuming Sakuya won't get over this and her story ending in shame? No I didn't, I said she would feel ashamed for letting those 2 down for a while, I know she will get over it and work things out in time and I merely made a guess as to what might happen.
Yes you did. You never said anything about her getting over it. You said all her character development would be wasted.
CybeastGregarX said: Which is exactly why as to how the Lost Servants' development has now been wasted because Sakuya couldn't fulfill that for them.
SpecterVonBaren said: Okay then. So why did you say this fight was bullshit? You said their development would go to waste and now you're saying it won't?
Need I repeat myself? I never said it won't, it went to waste for the competition since they were learning how to work as a team, and as to why this match was bullshit it suffered from bad script writing and its also bullshit on Lost Servants' side as well not just on Heavenly Sky's side which people fail to see from my past comments and just thinking I was only blaming HS.
Each of the teams received massive amounts of damage and like two minutes later they shook it off and were back on their feet, an example of this was when Suika was hit by Otsuho's God Chop while as a giant and had to be walked back to the ring by Sakuya and yet later after Sakuya pinned Tenshi Suika was able to get across the ring to block Otsuho from trying to save Tenshi.
Another example is that Tenshi receive more punishment then anyone else especially to her back and head, even more for her durability to handle so she should not have been able to even use that Crossrider Suplex and that headbutt without having intense pain done to herself since using a part of your body that's in pain inflicts even more pain to yourself and using a suplex involves stretching your back backwards, and if she did injured her back Sakuya would have freed herself giving her the win but she didn't since when Utsuho freed her when she escaped Suika's grip by transforming into a bird Tenshi instantly became invincible.
TheHunter said:
Yes you did. You never said anything about her getting over it. You said all her character development would be wasted.
And as I just said, it went to waste for the competition, and just because I don't say anything about that doesn't mean I actually mean that, of course she would get over it.
khinsu said: You do realize that your points for LS being boring to watch apply pretty much exactly to HS as well right. Sakuya gets hit and damage isn't done to her + negligible (in this match) damage reflect. Tenshi gets hit and damage isn't done to her + regen if it does. Suika grows big and hits things hard. Okuu shines red and hits things hard. Not much of a difference there.
If anything it's a matter of you not enjoying the characters as much.
Look at all the crazy stuff Okuu and Tenshi have done in this and their last match and tell me again that there's "not much difference there." Or don't. I'm not getting more than a toe in this post-match shitstorms anymore, unless some incredible bullshit like the end to Red 150%'s last match happens again.
ithekro said: There is still the Immortals vs 75% Red next. Who knows how long that will take since the Immortals won't even die if Reimu kills them.
In fact that might be how Red 75% could lose. Disqualification by killing one (or both) of the Immortals. They'll be fine, but they aren't quite like Cirno.
This is hopefully what will happen. Mokou and Kaguya will push Reimu far past her tipping point and she'll violently rip them apart in rage, and immortality be damned, she killed them so she's out.
Savato93 said: This is hopefully what will happen. Mokou and Kaguya will push Reimu far past her tipping point and she'll violently rip them apart in rage, and immortality be damned, she killed them so she's out.
Can't see it happening. It would be completely out of character for her in the series.
They could screw with Remilia easy enough, but even in the last match Reimu was just messing with Marisa.
Pyrolight said: Can't see it happening. It would be completely out of character for her in the series.
They could screw with Remilia easy enough, but even in the last match Reimu was just messing with Marisa.
I honestly have no idea what's going to happen for the next match. By all rights Red 75% should win by a landslide purely based on both teams showings but that wouldn't be very entertaining so I'm curious as to how Dei will do this.
ithekro said: Looking over the start of this event, Sanae's proposal was to give her own team a handicap. Her team would not be allowed to heal aside from emergency purposes until the fourth match, though they did have time to rest. Looks like Okuu and Tenshi are also held under that ruling, so they might not get all that fixed up during the next match, though they probably need some emergency care considering how beat up they are...even Okuu is down.
Sanae did that as to make things fair for her opponent who had to fight a match before facing Sanae.
While Yuuka/Cirno and Meiling/Flandre's losses might have been questionable, they did gain from their losses. (Yuuka seeing the fairies as actual friends and Flandre found a friend who isn't afraid to play with her)
Holy mother thats a crap ton of comments we got here. I would dare say this is one of the most sought after comics atm for danbooru.
Woot! Go Heavenly Sky, was rootin for ya to pull through with the win all the way ^_^ As long as you make something positive out of the outcome, you did great too Lost servants.
Freya211 said: Holy mother thats a crap ton of comments we got here. I would dare say this is one of the most sought after comics atm for danbooru.
Usually there so are very few comments or at least a dozen, its ridiculous how many comments are on this one comic strip compared to a lot of other pics here on Danbooru O_o
But then again most of the comments are by some of the same people, including me. :/
Freya211 said:
As long as you make something positive out of the outcome, you did great too Lost servants.
I'm so happy right now. As much as I like Sakuya, I've disliked dei_shirou's portrayal of her since the beginning. Maybe the defeat will lead to a shift in character for her. My team survives for another match; hang in there, HS, I'm rooting for you.
Now for the intermission side show and then a nice, satisfying heal stomping.
Pyrolight said: It would have been ridiculous for them to advance to possibly face Reimu/Remilia.
you seem to be under the impression that cliches are invariably bad, but that's not true; the way they're done or chosen can be good, or not (and even unintentional, if we have a fight determined by how well the players play the game instead of a plot-driven fight).
Pyrolight said: Anyway people have to realize that HS is the "Hero team".
- Fighting fair. - Growing in capabilities each match. - Bit of comic relief as well.
If Shirou sticks with the overall theme of the source material they should win the whole thing in the end.
it seems that you care much more for the plot than you do for the fights (and "fighting fair" has been debated to death already, I'm not biting it). Anyways, "hero team" or not, I don't identify myself or my playstyle with HS's, find their playstyle (and success rate) insulting, even, but stopped caring since I anticipate that their opponents will ultimately lose as well, because plot has taken priority (or was just a bad day in LS's team, either choosing a strategy that turned out to not be as effective as other options or not properly executed).
Nameless_Fool said: I'm genuinely surprised by this win. I thought Dei was gonna make Sakuya's plot armor impenetrable, but apparently that's not the case.
you were really afraid of Sakuya? Who's an human, must absolutely not miss her parries (for comparison, Tenshi got hurt from hitting her. Sakuya got way more from being hit after Tenshi started altering the timing of her hits) and also have to use her knowledge on locks (aided by her own ability) to counter a greater raw strength?
Both teams seem to have plot armor ("protagonist" plot armor, and Remi-Saku plot armor or Reimu's main character status), but I heard you like armor (Tenshi) so I've put an armor in yo armor so you can tank while you tank.
AdventZero said: This win didn't come without a loss for the HS team. As you can see, Okuu is more or less incapacitated herself. I only hope that we don't see another team switch again.
The match was, by far, the most intense and rewarding as I could recount in the tournament so far. It also helped that the HS won fighting with everything they've got. As for the results... Well, haters gonna hate. It's not their call, though, so too bad.
since when did the damages from HS's previous fight carry over to this one? That's why I say, Tenshi will get her full HP refill (cue Gill's "Ressurrection!!"), and it will be such another excruciating epopoeia to try to damage her to that point again. (unless Red 75% does wise up for alternatives regarding hitting Okuu instead, for example)
To be honest there's not a whole lot of strategy LS can do against HS. I mean look at their special abilities. Tenshi is just a 999 health tank with auto regen, and Okuu can hit real hard, fly and transform.
I've listed some ideas in the previous page, will post them here as well.
angrybull said: I was wrong about the final match being Sakuya vs Remilia. Now I have a reason to keep reading this series. I just hope that plot armor gets shattered in the end.
you don't realize how ironic (and puntastic) that last sentence is. Either way, we've plenty of armors (Tenshi/Reimu).
BrokenEagle98 said: To me, this whole match has been a brilliant display of Pride Before the Fall.
both Tenshi and Suika have said pride, but Tenshi has won this and the previous match, following said "prideful" "gameplan". I've stated in the previous page how Tenshi insists in trying to beat opponents in what they do best, and only Suika's overconfidence gets punished. LS and White Lotus can't fight fate, at all.
BrokenEagle98 said: As it is shown in post #1218667, Sakuya and Suika gave the impression of not even considering their next opponents as a challenge, and their actions, speech and thoughts shown during the match only strengthened that impression.
Whereas, Tenshi and Okuu were shown to be focused on their upcoming match with Sakuya and Suika, and gave the impression that they took this match seriously, which was only strengthened throughout the match.
huh, nothing special on the strip you've linked. Unless you mean the 3rd panel balloons, which if you noticed, don't come from LS.
Also, LS totally haven't studied HS, right? Even having prepared a pin specially for Tenshi.
BrokenEagle98 said: To quote Sakuya in the previous strip (post #1314799): - "There's nothing left for me if I lose..." - "I can't lose!" - "I don't want to lose!!" Those sound like the thoughts of every arrogant rival when they lose to the unlikely hero.
if she loses, she won't meet Remi in the *finals*, duh.
Kilgamayan said: Well, it's kind of difficult for storytelling to not take precedence in a one-shot Touhou wrestling series. Pro wrestling can get away with heel victories long-term because it never ends, but this series will presumably end not too long after the final match, which means climaxes must be hit and conclusions must be reached. With that in mind, the author is (presumably) going to go with what he or she thinks is the most fulfilling story for his or her audience. If that story happens to be one about two lovable oafs rising through the ranks and grabbing the brass ring that not many, inside or outside the story, thought they were capable of getting, then so be it. Such a decision would be hardly surprising - I would bet fewer people would find a Reimu/Remilia victory more fulfilling than most other teams, for example, because they're expected to be tops and haven't really even tried very hard yet. No one really learns anything if they win, if that makes sense.
while I read this, I was thinking; what if the true protagonist was actually the one that was voted in the Scarlet 200% fight against whatever's Sanae x Suwako's team? (what if the author had an alternate route for Scarlet 200% in case it won?)
StriderTuna said: Not always, look at Marisa's team; they were the underdogs and their assult was like a gnat versus an Elephant. Certainly comes off better than the weak part of a team getting wins against teams stronger than them. (Mind you said weak part has gotten a win that was legitimate.)
correct me if I'm mistaken, but are you advocating that strength should take priority over how well the players play the game? If the game is reduced to a test of strength, then it stops being interesting.
ithekro said: Remi of course only wanted to win (nothing else will do for her pride) and Reimu is in it only for the prize money. I wonder what Sakuya's lose will do to Remi's point of view. (Reimu still wants the money...not starving afterwards is important to her).
My fight moneyyyyyyy (had to do it, sorry :D)
Now I wonder if Mima will help HS (because they're fighting against Reimu) or stay neutral. Even though HS will win :(
Pyrolight said: Like Sakuya was not a one trick pony.
she's a two-trick pony (parry, grapples and the unseen drunken form), and with her parries, she can also do stuff like repelling Okuu's first drop and mimicking Tenshi's hard head (from HS's previous fight).
Zaku_Zelo said: Honestly, I'm happy Lost Servents lost because...well, they aren't a fun team to watch. What do they do? Sakuya's got that time shield thing, which is effective, but not really interesting to watch. People hit her and they get hurt instead. Suika hits things, then gets big and hits things. Woo. Despite all the plot stuff revolving around them...okay, revolving around Sakuya, and even that wasn't that great, it doesn't change how dull they are.
while I agree that their repertoire wasn't as developed as HS's, I (once again) will say that I appreciate more technical teams/players. HS could've been much more dreadful if they had the proper mindset (and that includes Tenshi not being stubborn, even if that's her personality), but until then, I'm not rooting for them.
@ monhan:
since my time is nearly over for now, I'll copy-paste the stuff from the previous page, which also deals with what you posted in this page. (and also a post reply for Steak -- but not limited to him -- because getting creative with ideas about how to fry Okuu is always nice)
monhan said: Like I said, they underestimated Okuu too much and it's not like LS is being very tactical either in this match. And you're underestimating Byakuren now, I'd say she's better than Suika in her Superhuman state.
I can't confirm the latter but, the worst (ha ha) has happened, they didn't finish the DPS and they let her do her job (no pun.. intended?)
monhan said: Who said they're not skilled? To pull off all the stunts they had done is pretty skillful for me. They got the wits and is also good in making quick decisions.
quick decisions and adaptability, I agree (though Tenshi insists in trying to defeat other people in their field of advantage, which -- while showy -- is counterproductive); Sakuya said that she came with lots of strategies, but the outcome was rather disappointing, for the "preparation" she said they've done. Can agree that people underestimated Okuu by not properly stopping her assistances (but honestly don't see HS's gimmicks stopping to work on the latter matches)
While Okuu came up with some moves (two of them planned -- the fast followup after bird form, though the act of changing into bird itself was desperate, and the nuke on giant-sized Suika), most of what she did was reaction or improvisation (using her aerial mobility against Suika, her footstomp, okuudive save, carrying Suika out). It's okay for it to work, but LS could've avoided that (by not letting Okuu play) but didn't. Also, Okuu is canonically a birdbrain, it's either surprising or out-of-character for her to come up with a long-term plan.
Regarding Tenshi, she's shown to be adaptable but not very bright (Satori had to tell her how Sakuya's defense works), while she can find counters on reaction, she also tried to get off Sakuya's grapples through brute force, which worked against her (and almost cost her the match, wasn't for Okuustomp). Suika took notice of the damage done to Tenshi's body when she first entered the ring, but, ultimately, such "careful" examining was just for show. :(
Finally, some things (that I may not have said before): - Suika used her "counter" against peach bomber, thanks to Kanako, Sakuya had help from Yukari for her second-to-last pin (though Yukari hasn't expected her training to be used the way Sakuya did) - Yukari (canonically) doesn't get along with Tenshi (the latter has tried to take possession of the Hakurei Shrine in SWR, Yukari had to re-destroy and get the shrine re-rebuilt to remove the keystone that was placed on it); celestials' flesh are poisonous to youkai, and Tenshi tried to take territories outside her own land, even when she and/or the other celestials had more than enough land, as per Yukari's investigation. - HS's opponents should have characters rooting for them as well :(
Steak said: HS's only strength is everyone's refusal to put Okuu down like a dog. Her attacks should be easy to counter and evade, but her opponents practically, even literally, let her hit them.
some seemingly viable strategies (besides the one attempted here, to create a crack on Tenshi's armor) include: - K.O.ing Okuu so heavily that she's out of commission for the remainder of her fight, then tagging out constantly while tiring Tenshi out (has the benefit of no partner-assistance for Tenshi and/or team moves) and regenerating the "red HP" - use Tenshi to beat Okuu (more practical), who isn't nearly as durable as Tenshi is - use Okuu's nukes against Tenshi (more difficult) - damage Okuu's limbs so that if she tries to use the nukes, they'll come out with less power (in b4 she can use her head or body or ass or whatever else for nuking too..) - remove Tenshi from the field and pin a damaged Okuu (making sure to deal with her bird form), or vice-versa :D
BrokenEagle98 said: As it is shown in post #1218667, Sakuya and Suika gave the impression of not even considering their next opponents as a challenge, and their actions, speech and thoughts shown during the match only strengthened that impression.
Whereas, Tenshi and Okuu were shown to be focused on their upcoming match with Sakuya and Suika, and gave the impression that they took this match seriously, which was only strengthened throughout the match.
huh, nothing special on the strip you've linked. Unless you mean the 3rd panel balloons, which if you noticed, don't come from LS.
Also, LS totally haven't studied HS, right? Even having prepared a pin specially for Tenshi.
LS and HS are talking about Team Moriya (who had just finished their match). LS is already focusing on taking out Suwako and Sanae, and basically ignoring HS as a serious enemy...especially Suika since she later classes them as idiots. HS on the other hand is focusing on LS.
Suika at least from her phrasing seems to be expecting to take on Sanae and Suwako. No real worry about Tenshi and Okuu. Sakuya seems to be thinking of something else.
LS and HS are talking about Team Moriya (who had just finished their match). LS is already focusing on taking out Suwako and Sanae, and basically ignoring HS as a serious enemy...especially Suika since she later classes them as idiots. HS on the other hand is focusing on LS.
[/quote]
Too bad for them, then. Never underestimate the opponent, like what many have learned this weekend.
How lovely to see that someone is being a child and is downvoting several comments that support the Heavenly Sky win. Not that this is surprising given how this seems to happen after every match end but it's still juvenile.
Pyrolight said: Like Sakuya was not a one trick pony.
And her trick was countered numerous times and in different ways throughout the entire match. It happened so often that I expected Sakuya to adapt and overcome the weakness in her technique. Like the mind's eye, your intuition, seeing without seeing. Sakuya knew Tenshi was charging, she didn't need to see to anticipate it.
Compare that to Okuu's who's trick is so flaming obvious and so potent that it should be everyone's number one concern throughout the entire match and yet...it's used without fail.
SpecterVonBaren said: How lovely to see that someone is being a child and is downvoting several comments that support the Heavenly Sky win. Not that this is surprising given how this seems to happen after every match end but it's still juvenile.
"I don't know how to counter these arguments, or am too lazy to do so, but I REALLY dislike them... I KNOW!"
shadowbringer said: she's a two-trick pony (parry, grapples and the unseen drunken form), and with her parries, she can also do stuff like repelling Okuu's first drop and mimicking Tenshi's hard head (from HS's previous fight).
By the end of the match I liked both teams pretty well and would have been satisfied if either one won. Either one could have taken the victory, and I wouldn't have felt slighted. It was an enjoyable match. Originally I was rooting for HS, but I liked Lost Servants too. I just hope that they're both good sports about it, and I hope that Remilia doesn't chew Sakuya out. If she does, though, I'll bet you anything that there's gonna be a FRIENDSHIP speech from Suika.
I just did a quick test comparing the word counts from the first 24 hours of comments for the end of this match and the first 24 hours of comments for the end of the Reimu/Marisa match (post #968227), and if you ignore shadowbringer's egregiously long comment, then the total comment mass generated by the end of this match (~8700 words) is similar to the Reimu/Marisa match (~8300 words). None of the other matches are even close to having generated as many comments as these two.
It's hard to draw anything conclusive from this, since maybe it's just that more people are reading this story now, or maybe it's drawn in more people that like to comment more, but it'll be interesting to see if the coming semifinals generate as much flotsam.
Steak said: And her trick was countered numerous times and in different ways throughout the entire match. It happened so often that I expected Sakuya to adapt and overcome the weakness in her technique. Like the mind's eye, your intuition, seeing without seeing. Sakuya knew Tenshi was charging, she didn't need to see to anticipate it.
You realize she has to anticipate it to a severely small window (less than a second or whatever) in order for it to be effective right? She had a hard enough time achieving that with sight.
monhan said: You've done well, Okuu! Take your rest, you deserved it. This is her(and Tenshi's) ERA after all! Congratulations Heavenly Sky! And also props for the Lost Servants! It was an awesome match!
ftahgn said: Both sides did a good job of fighting. Congrats to HS for winning!
Still, it's hard to tell from that pic. Tenshi's shoulders seems to be on at mat as well, so there may be a chance that it could be a draw. Moments like that have happened in wrestling, after all. Well, it's probably best to wait for the translations.
Manslayer said: Imagine Suika's expression in the 4th panel. And YES, congratulations to HS!
LostAgain said: I like this outcome, HS fought tooth and nail just to get into the tournament and I find their matches so far to be the most interesting.
aListers said: Yes! Finally! That's the first time that the team that I supported actually won the match!
Congratulations heavenly sky! May the tournament be yours!
Pyrolight said: Hardly wasted. Sakuya likely showed Remelia that she could fight.
That was the point for her.
It would have been ridiculous for them to advance to possibly face Reimu/Remilia.
Anyway people have to realize that HS is the "Hero team".
- Fighting fair. - Growing in capabilities each match. - Bit of comic relief as well.
If Shirou sticks with the overall theme of the source material they should win the whole thing in the end.
ubr1999 said: Great! Tenshi & Okku win! Well, after this, the only thing that I worry now it´s about hers next battle against Sanae's Team... :S But, I'm satisfied with this results :D
Zaku_Zelo said: Honestly, I'm happy Lost Servents lost because...well, they aren't a fun team to watch. What do they do? Sakuya's got that time shield thing, which is effective, but not really interesting to watch. People hit her and they get hurt instead. Suika hits things, then gets big and hits things. Woo. Despite all the plot stuff revolving around them...okay, revolving around Sakuya, and even that wasn't that great, it doesn't change how dull they are.
Possessed_by_Phoenix said: Not at all, the most important development as someone mentioned is Pride Before the Fall. Even before the match, since the beginning, Sakuya's main vice was portrayed to be her pride. She was too proud to ask Meiling, thinking it's the role of others she saw as underneath her to beg her. Initially she didn't even treat Koakuma as a companion, referring to her as "that".
It has been a journey to open her up and accept that this tournament should be about people having fun and giving it their all. Koakuma proved her worth, Suika and her antics loosened her up, and I suspect upcoming strips will have her come to realization and respect everyone's efforts rather than treating everything as stepping stones in her path of destiny to the mistress.
Pyrolight said: It's even too chiche for this comic. Not to mention it would be a rofl stomping of a match.
Suika could hold her own but Sakuya even with her hax would be utterly destroyed.
I agree, in pretty much in every respect a LS win would not have advanced the story at all.
Too many better teams have lost to less interesting ones. It's nice to see to one finally win.
Freya211 said: Holy mother thats a crap ton of comments we got here. I would dare say this is one of the most sought after comics atm for danbooru.
Woot! Go Heavenly Sky, was rootin for ya to pull through with the win all the way ^_^ As long as you make something positive out of the outcome, you did great too Lost servants.
Evol_Lanrete said: I'm crying tears of joy from this outcome.
Notice a pattern with all these down voted comments? All of them were ones praising the Heavenly Sky win. Some people are really childish.
So glad to see Heavenly Sky win! No offense to LS, but Utsuho is my favorite character, I quite like Tenshi and their off-fight dialogues have been fun and refreshing compared to all the other ones (Which are good, but have a different atmosphere to them, usually more serious). Plus, I quite like the way Utsuho's God Hand/Feet work! (Why can I just see their last battle involving Utsuho using it twice and actually breaking her hand?)
this was probably my favorite match so far because it was hard to tell who was gonna win plus it was just a lot of fun
And the countdown has started!The Decision Seen From Outside the Ring
Episode 971: Round 2 of the semifinals, over.From the Artist's Pixiv page.And it's overrrrrrr!!At last!The Lost Servant Combination has finally used up all of their strength!!The one that will be advancing to the main event is......The Heavenly Sky Combination!!