Mmmmm.... I'm not exactly sure about this one. The proportions are exaggerated but for sexual appeal, not to be anatomically accurate.
My stance on the bad proportions tag is that it is to be used if bodily proportions are blatantly out of place with one another. The anatomy doesn't make all that much sense here (greatly exaggerated) but it isn't really out of place. Especially for this artist's artstyle. Many other posts would fall under the same reasoning of this post.
Mmmmm.... I'm not exactly sure about this one. The proportions are exaggerated but for sexual appeal, not to be anatomically accurate.
My stance on the bad proportions tag is that it is to be used if bodily proportions are blatantly out of place with one another. The anatomy doesn't make all that much sense here (greatly exaggerated) but it isn't really out of place. Especially for this artist's artstyle. Many other posts would fall under the same reasoning of this post.
I'll give it maybe a few before reconsidering.
As I keep saying to this sort of argument, "this is how this artist always draws people, so if you delete this one, you have to delete a lot more of their works," is on par with "there's worse stuff on Danbooru," and is an argument that is more likely to backfire than not. There are a lot of artists who just plain aren't good that aren't uploaded and would not be approved if uploaded. By the logic of that argument, as soon as one image "gets the artist's foot in the door," it becomes far more difficult to ever flag or not approve anything they make. (Unless it's "not their style", but that basically means arguing the artist wasn't themselves, which is a rather odd argument to need to make...) Besides, that kind of argument just tells whoever flagged this that they need to follow the artist tag to flag more of their works.
In any event, it's the images that are for sexual appeal or are just for pure aesthetics/"pure art" that have the highest standards for anatomy and artstyle placed upon them, since there's nothing else recommending them, and there's plenty of examples of female anatomy on Danbooru. Humorous posts have something else to say, and jokes on breast size get some measure of exemption for the "grotesque" sizes. post #2312047 and its children, I would say, get more leniency because it is expressly about breast size comparison, rather than "for sexual appeal" alone. If, however, you say "it's fine if it's for sexual appeal," the question isn't what you're preventing from being excluded, but what still can be excluded once that standard is in place? The vast majority of the anatomy-flagged images were images made for sexual appeal, so that's basically overturning every single flag or even lack of approval on images, right there. What anatomy or even basic quality standard can stand if you say "if someone thinks it's sexy, we have to let it in"?
Likewise, saying that if this post is flagged for anatomy, other posts need to be flagged for anatomy is kind of moot. There already are lots of posts being flagged for anatomy for these exact same reasons every day. If you're worried about setting precedent, that ship has not just sailed, it's circumnavigated the globe by now.
As I keep saying to this sort of argument, "this is how this artist always draws people, so if you delete this one, you have to delete a lot more of their works," is on par with "there's worse stuff on Danbooru," and is an argument that is more likely to backfire than not. There are a lot of artists who just plain aren't good that aren't uploaded and would not be approved if uploaded. By the logic of that argument, as soon as one image "gets the artist's foot in the door," it becomes far more difficult to ever flag or not approve anything they make. (Unless it's "not their style", but that basically means arguing the artist wasn't themselves, which is a rather odd argument to need to make...) Besides, that kind of argument just tells whoever flagged this that they need to follow the artist tag to flag more of their works.
That's exactly the point I'm making though. If this isn't acceptable, then so are many of magister's other uploads. I'm not entirely for or against that, but this is a flag reason that, like on many other posts I've commented, shows way too much scrutiny. As cd young said, it's because her left arm is pushing up against her breast, yet the shading doesn't really show that that well.
The hips-to-waist ratio I can agree on at least that much, it's super hourglass. I just believe that if users really think it belongs here, and if the appeals show that to be true, then we should at least consider these things in tandem. Anatomy aside, the lines, shading, and composition are more than acceptable. Enough to offset the potential mistakes here? Maybe, maybe not. I like his work, but I wouldn't make the best judge here. At least, alone.
The "sexual appeal" isn't the be-all-end-all to ignore these kinds of things -- those posts must show an appreciation for good anatomy and artstyle, but I'm making it out to be that the anatomy isn't the one thing that this post should be graded on.
That's exactly the point I'm making though. If this isn't acceptable, then so are many of magister's other uploads. I'm not entirely for or against that, but this is a flag reason that, like on many other posts I've commented, shows way too much scrutiny. As cd young said, it's because her left arm is pushing up against her breast, yet the shading doesn't really show that that well.
The hips-to-waist ratio I can agree on at least that much, it's super hourglass. I just believe that if users really think it belongs here, and if the appeals show that to be true, then we should at least consider these things in tandem. Anatomy aside, the lines, shading, and composition are more than acceptable. Enough to offset the potential mistakes here? Maybe, maybe not. I like his work, but I wouldn't make the best judge here. At least, alone.
The "sexual appeal" isn't the be-all-end-all to ignore these kinds of things -- those posts must show an appreciation for good anatomy and artstyle, but I'm making it out to be that the anatomy isn't the one thing that this post should be graded on.
Anatomy isn't the one thing it's graded on, but it's a necessary component. Simply having wheels is not the only thing you are likely to make your judgement of which car to buy upon, but if that car doesn't have wheels, you're probably not going to want to take that car.
Anatomy is just a more critical component on a sexual appeal or pure aesthetic image because it's fundamental to the appreciation and also there are not as many other factors. I will judge a humorous post on whether I find it funny, or at least novel, or not. For that reason, I'm more interested in the subversion of memes than straight meme images. (I.E. the tank wearing the virgin killer sweater over just another random girl in one.)
Anyway, outside of a propensity for thick thighs and short legs (see comments), just looking through this artist shows this body type is far from the only thing they draw, and they actually do a lot of pettan work, at that. This just seems to be an artist with no sense of moderation, going from one extreme to the other. Regardless, if this image were deleted, then it would not mean any sort of purge of this artist would start, whether it's deleted or not, who drew a work is immaterial to the judgement of the individual work.
So far as "scrutiny" goes, well, all flags about quality or anatomy involve scrutiny, so that's a really ambiguous argument. If the breast is meant to be deformed by the arm, but there's no wrinkles or deformity or shading to make it notable, then doesn't it take scrutiny to notice it's meant to be deformed by the arm? Should scrutiny be fine to defend a work, but not criticize it? (And isn't that lack of detail to support that deformation something worth criticizing, itself?)
Anatomy isn't the one thing it's graded on, but it's a necessary component. Simply having wheels is not the only thing you are likely to make your judgement of which car to buy upon, but if that car doesn't have wheels, you're probably not going to want to take that car.
Anatomy is just a more critical component on a sexual appeal or pure aesthetic image because it's fundamental to the appreciation and also there are not as many other factors. I will judge a humorous post on whether I find it funny, or at least novel, or not. For that reason, I'm more interested in the subversion of memes than straight meme images. (I.E. the tank wearing the virgin killer sweater over just another random girl in one.)
Anyway, outside of a propensity for thick thighs and short legs (see comments), just looking through this artist shows this body type is far from the only thing they draw, and they actually do a lot of pettan work, at that. This just seems to be an artist with no sense of moderation, going from one extreme to the other. Regardless, if this image were deleted, then it would not mean any sort of purge of this artist would start, whether it's deleted or not, who drew a work is immaterial to the judgement of the individual work.
So far as "scrutiny" goes, well, all flags about quality or anatomy involve scrutiny, so that's a really ambiguous argument. If the breast is meant to be deformed by the arm, but there's no wrinkles or deformity or shading to make it notable, then doesn't it take scrutiny to notice it's meant to be deformed by the arm? Should scrutiny be fine to defend a work, but not criticize it? (And isn't that lack of detail to support that deformation something worth criticizing, itself?)
I think it's more a matter of quality of the scrutiny, to be honest. There were flagged posts that I reapproved despite the flag reason because a flag usually details why a post should be deleted, not why it shouldn't be. In this way it is a call for review, but it's biased towards deleting a post than not. Ironically, posts that skip the queue don't get so much of the saving grace that posts that go through it do. Perhaps as contributors some of our uploads just aren't trusted by the rest of the userbase. Well, the picky ones.
The scrutiny can be used to defend a post both ways, in that if a user is paying too much attention without disregard to the rest of the composition (mistaking mittens for bad hands, for example) then others, usually approvers like ourselves, have to cover for that area whenever we reapprove something.
Good anatomy is necessary, yes, but it's not as if you don't have any wheels... More like you just don't have good tires, if that makes the analogy any clearer to myself or someone else.
