There's no way to tell if it's Skullshatterer or "Skullshatterer" under the mask.
To this day, I still don't understand the whole plot point of that thing. Like why would you start killing the very people you know who are trying to fix the situation? The concept of Arknights is cool, but I'm a little meh on the story so far.
To this day, I still don't understand the whole plot point of that thing. Like why would you start killing the very people you know who are trying to fix the situation? The concept of Arknights is cool, but I'm a little meh on the story so far.
Then you weren't paying that much attention. Not everyone trusts Rhodes Island, and a lot of infected think they're just as bad as everyone else because they don't side with Reunion against the non-infected.
Spoilers
Misha already wasn't very trusting of RI, and it's easy to say, "We're the good guys, we're trying to help." but that doesn't mean what you're doing is actually changing anything. For someone like Misha, whose family was torn apart because of the infection, and has lived miserably since, it's hard to see how RI is really helping anything, when the infection is still spreading and infected are still being treated like garbage. When she gets abducted by Reunion, not only is she reunited with the brother she had watched be dragged away by an angry mob, but all she saw were normal, suffering people, who had been abused and driven away from their homes, all because they had contracted a disease that normally doesn't even transfer between living people. And these people were fighting back, they were passionate and united. With the death of her brother at the hands of RI shortly after, Misha came to the conclusion that these poor people needed a symbol to follow, Skullshatterer was that symbol, and she had never been convinced that RI was any better for the infected than Reunion was. From her perspective, she chose the side that needed her more, and took on her brother's will.
Then you weren't paying that much attention. Not everyone trusts Rhodes Island, and a lot of infected think they're just as bad as everyone else because they don't side with Reunion against the non-infected.
Spoilers
Misha already wasn't very trusting of RI, and it's easy to say, "We're the good guys, we're trying to help." but that doesn't mean what you're doing is actually changing anything. For someone like Misha, whose family was torn apart because of the infection, and has lived miserably since, it's hard to see how RI is really helping anything, when the infection is still spreading and infected are still being treated like garbage. When she gets abducted by Reunion, not only is she reunited with the brother she had watched be dragged away by an angry mob, but all she saw were normal, suffering people, who had been abused and driven away from their homes, all because they had contracted a disease that normally doesn't even transfer between living people. And these people were fighting back, they were passionate and united. With the death of her brother at the hands of RI shortly after, Misha came to the conclusion that these poor people needed a symbol to follow, Skullshatterer was that symbol, and she had never been convinced that RI was any better for the infected than Reunion was. From her perspective, she chose the side that needed her more, and took on her brother's will.
To add onto that, I'd also add that she was likely manipulated into it by W, who goaded her brother into launching an assault that W probably knew would just end in his death. I would also wager that W set that chain of events into motion knowing full and well that Misha would also be killed as a result. All to get something out of the Doctor or Amiya. Reunion... is not exactly the most unified organization.
Yeah, but the person in question literally saw the difference in how RH only attacks if attacked or to save others (hell, the kids she was with were attacked by SS's forces!), she saw SS's outburst of rage and the fact that no one in Reunion had any plan at all to fix the situation for infected (hell, Reunion attacks and ruins the lives of other infected more than Lungmen fixers, as we saw in the slums).
The whole reasoning for that plot point was really silly IMO. It makes sense for Skullshatter and his forces to think the way they did (Skullshatter fell into despair, his forces look up to him for his loyalty to other infected unlike some other Reunion ringleaders), but it makes no sense for the person in question to think the same way. Most people would think a lot closer to Amiya, especially if you just saw how Reunion is bat shit crazy half the time.
I think it would have made more sense and had more impact if the person in question tried to convince SS's forces to join Rhodes and they either kidnapped her claiming she wasn't thinking straight, killed her as a traitor to infected-kind, or decided to follow her (but only trust her, not Rhodes island). The latter IMO would have been a really cool story route, and would give more opportunities to demonstrate the mindset of the outcast infected. The only reason they made her go full retard was to try and make Amiya's leadership seem ineffective and morally ambiguous to insert drama and have Doctah have to comfort her.
How does it make no sense for Misha to have similar feelings to Skullshatterer and the other Reunion members? Did you miss the part where SS was her brother? Where the systematic oppression of the infected destroyed her family and forced her to live in the slums of the city known for having the second worst treatment of infected, all alone and believing her entire family dead? She has every reason to empathize with the average reunion member, she suffered the exact same hardships they did. She knew RI for all of an hour, and had no more reason to trust them than anyone else. Funny thing about oppression, it has a way of turning otherwise normal people into killers and anarchists, especially when someone incites them into it.
Why would fanatical reunion members, who have pretty clearly already given up on peace and diplomacy, just drop everything and join up with the opposing group that has already heartlessly killed so many of their friends and allies? What basis would there even be for a conflict if it were that easy to just give up on your ideals? You honestly think that most people, after suffering the way infected have, would think like Amiya?
I guess the story would be way better if all of the characters made only the best, most logical decisions using information they don't actually have access to, then? Everyone should just automatically trust RI, the large, secretive pharmaceutical company that, on top of at times looking more like a military movement, doesn't even treat infected for free and seems to spend more time than anything else killing other infected, I guess. Just a bland, empty story where things only go well, you save everyone and no one has to die.
Rhodes is also composed of infected, and the person in question had even less time with Reunion than she did with RI. There is no reason for there to be loyalty strictly to Reunion, especially since it is clear Reunion doesn't have much loyalty to each other outside of small circles like Skullshatterer's example. The interaction with W made that clear. If this was about oppression, then it makes even less sense for survivors of Ursus to start attacking other infected in the Lungmen slums, and overall making a shitty situation even worse there. It makes less sense for one who has survivor's guilt to want to join Reunion, when one has seen first hand that Reunion attacks normal and infected.
Reunion doesn't make sense because Tallulah's whole solution to everything is to burn it all down. That's part of the problem with Reunion, at the footsoldier level, they really don't have ideals or motivation to belong strictly to Reunion. The whole concept is that people who were driven out joined Reunion only because there was nowhere else to go. Not because they have any real common goal, outside of the ringleaders.
When you have someone who has seen both sides, how does it make any sense at all to choose Reunion over Rhodes Island? One side is ramming against a wall, the other side is at least looking for a cure and trying to mediate a common ground between the cities and the infected. It's not even about logic, even if one had basic survival instinct as an originium infected (a supposedly terminal condition), attacking the one faction that is working on treatments and cures for my disease sounds like a really nonsensical motivation.
SS and his follower's motivations made sense because they don't know anything about RI, and the exchange with Franka made it seem like RI only cared about Lungmen agenda, but not for "SS" who knows better. Heck, if they wanted the whole "we killed our own" kind of situation, they should have not made Amiya have a heart to heart conversation with the person in question. It should have just been an impersonal snatch and grab, with the conflict arising from a lack of understanding due to time constraints of the extraction.
You have some good points here and there, but Reunion's message makes sense when you look at it from the fanatical point of view. They want to destroy the very world that is trying to destroy them, whether from oppressive regimes, bigotry, or the disease itself. Misha was just like those foot soldiers. Scared, desperate, eager to lash out at anything and anyone. W and Alex both gave her a perspective to see from. Even though she had spoken to Amiya earlier, she did see Amiya murder her brother, or at the very least knew RI killed him. Which is why she became "SS" to help her brother's followers escape and tried to kill you as the one responsible for taking away her last living relative.
Misha's part in the plot isn't all important, it was more to illuminate how the average Reunion person thinks and Amiya's growth as RI's leader. Forcing her to let go of some of her idealism.
When you have someone who has seen both sides, how does it make any sense at all to choose Reunion over Rhodes Island? One side is ramming against a wall, the other side is at least looking for a cure and trying to mediate a common ground between the cities and the infected. It's not even about logic, even if one had basic survival instinct as an originium infected (a supposedly terminal condition), attacking the one faction that is working on treatments and cures for my disease sounds like a really nonsensical motivation.
Except that people don't know what RI is doing. The company might claim to be working on a cure for the infection, but unless you've actually been inside the compound, that's just an empty promise. They've made no actual progress towards a cure as far as the average civilian is concerned, and they've certainly done nothing to stop the mistreatment of infected. They also don't know that RI is meeting with faction leaders, or anything else about the company outside of the few things they've made public, because nearly everything the company does is classified even among most operatives. Misha never saw the inside of RI, they just showed up and tried to take them away, making idealistic promises. More people see them as a military force than a pharmaceutical company, and it's not hard to see why.
And Reunion does have a goal, to overturn the society that oppresses them. The leaders obviously seem to have vastly different goals, but this isn't about them, this is about the people at the bottom fanatically following every order given to them, attacking anyone that resists them because if you're not with them, you're against them. You can't expect a group that's persecuted by the hundreds everyday to make rational decisions, especially based on information they simply don't have, and Misha is a member of that group.
Rhodes is also composed of infected, and the person in question had even less time with Reunion than she did with RI.
The brother she thought to be dead from getting mauled by an angry mob because he was an infected
appears before her as a squad leader of a cause that fight for the infected's right. That's a reason enough to believe in the cause, even only for sake of the brother and his men who charge through fire just to retrieve his body.
That's part of the problem with Reunion, at the footsoldier level, they really don't have ideals or motivation to belong strictly to Reunion. The whole concept is that people who were driven out joined Reunion only because there was nowhere else to go. Not because they have any real common goal, outside of the ringleaders.
In case you missed the exposition about Big Bob in Grani's event, Reunion was actually pretty well-known before they turn into a radical anarchist movement as pro-infected activists making peaceful protests. Their cause is common knowledge. While the head honcho's ulterior motives might not be those causes, it doesn't matter for the bottom rung guys because Reunion is THE movement for the infected. You think Lenin and Stalin could just suddenly raised an army to topple the Tsar out of nowhere? Chernobog's fall is basically an analogy.
When you have someone who has seen both sides, how does it make any sense at all to choose Reunion over Rhodes Island?
The person in question hadn't see everything about RI; all she has was Amiya's words and all known (even that's still ambiguous if their involvement is known to public) RI's feat was being a PMC in Sarkaz Civil War. We're known more for our operator hoarding and mining gold for Rim Billiton than our work to fight against Oripathy. There's almost no information available about our research for the common people. Why should they believe us unless we bring them to our Ark, which the person in question hadn't got the chance for? You're overestimating our persuasive power against a person who was traumatized from seeing the atrocity of war.
She knew SS was unhinged from the start though, he was very different than before. And it isn't like RI attacked him randomly. She has seen firsthand that RI has reasoned with people like they did with her, rather than using their overwhelming force to extract her. Even if she did irrationally hate RI as a result, how does it make sense to fight an enemy you know is more powerful than SS? At least join Reunion, develop a basis for motivation as an enemy ringleader before going all guilt trip on Amiya.
blindVigil said: ...
DAS58 said: ...
Reunion members really aren't choosing to be with Reunion. They are desperate because there is nowhere else to go and reunion is the only real infected friendly option available to the general infected individual. Operators of RI don't just move to Reunion en masse, there is no real attraction to Reunion. The only reason infected aren't running to RI is because RI is covert and lacks the resources for widespread humanitarian missions. If people had the choice they definitely would go RI over reunion. The person in question is unique from the typical Reunion cannon fodder as she has the ability to choose something other than Reunion.
I can definitely understand infected in general not trusting RI. But it doesn't make sense for her specifically to trust Reunion in particular. I know Reunion had more peaceful beginnings, but she has firsthand experience with the "real" Reunion, post Ursus when they start ransacking the ghetto in Lungmen, composed mostly of infected. In contrast she has seen that RI is willing to reason and do what they can to protect others. Again, it makes sense for SS and other followers to act the way they did, but she has zero reasoning to act how she did. She had all kinds of options that would have made more sense (coordinate an actual full retreat with W, mediate with the second in command, etc), but her decision was instead to go full retard where no one benefited.
And this inconsistency in motivation could have been easily avoided by simply making the script where Amiya's squad didn't have time to be all nice and build a rapport, but clash with Reunion at the same time of finding her, resulting in a rushed extraction where she can't tell what makes RI different from Lungmen enforcement or infected haters. Then it would look that RI, not just Reunion were infected attacking other infected. Then her reaction would actually make sense. When they make her and Amiya good friends prior to being handed over to Chen, then her later actions contradict the character relationships that were being built up to this time.